MD-80 freighter conversion announced

**DHG750R** · 02-11-2010, 01:43 AM

Aeronautical Engineers Inc. announced formal launch of an MD-80SF passenger-to-freighter conversion program focusing on modification of MD-81, MD-82, MD-83 and MD-88 series aircraft. It expects initial certification by summer 2011 and plans to certify the program with FAA, EASA, and CAAC. According to AEI, the MD-80SF will offer up to 12 88x108-in. ULDs including a custom 108-in. container, 47,000 lb. of upper deck cargo capacity and up to 4,400 cu. ft. of main deck volume. Conversions will take 75 days. Development costs are "being fully funded by AEI including the purchase of prototype aircraft."

**Mayi757** · 02-11-2010, 04:08 AM

Beautiful news ! Stretching the life of the Maddog as a freighter would bring more aircraft variety. I suppose the MD-80 being narrower yet longer, would offer more capacity than 737s and could be taken up by operators using old 727s and 737s.

Will the MD-80 freighter be more economical/cheaper than 737s and 757s?

**hiss srq** · 02-11-2010, 10:35 AM

Due to its fuse width I question how many US companies are going to buy this. If I am not mistaken you cannot take standard sized pallets on the main deck of the DC9 and wouldnt be able to on the 80 either. IF I am wrong correct me. I do love the 80 and I would LOVE to see it plying the sky in the US as a freighter.

**Mayi757** · 02-11-2010, 06:01 PM

hey Hiss Srq, don't the DC-8 and MD-80 have the same fuselage width?

I thought about you said also, but Airborne Express/DHL had DC-9s along with DC-8s, the latter used to be the most common freighter worldwide until recently.

**LGA777** · 02-11-2010, 06:31 PM

Mayi757, the DC-9 and MD-80 have the same width, the DC-8 is considerably wider, offering a 3-3 coach config vs. 2-3 for the DC-9/MD-80. And Hiss Srq you are correct that the MD-80F cannot except standard pallets, and as mentioned in the article at the begining of the thread it will accept a custom 108 inch ULD. While that would be a deterent to some operators the large potential numbers of available MD-80's in the next few years combined with the relativly low acquisition cost will make up for the odd-ball container size I believe !

Regards

LGA777

**Mayi757** · 02-13-2010, 03:38 AM

Doh! totally forgot (I'm getting old).

LGA777 I completely forgot DC-8 was 3 and 3 seating. Somehow the similarities in nose shape of the Douglas classics made me forget, hah. Actually the DC-8 is probably about as wide as the 727/737/707.

Maybe the significant length of the MD-80 over the 737 could make up for not taking standard pallets and could make it useful as a freighter. It has one engine less than the 727. There are some DC-9 short bodied freighters out there.

As for standard pallets are we talking about 2 standard containers side by side (like under the belly)? Or top is loaded with bigger pallets that fit all the way across? I don't really know.

**cancidas** · 02-13-2010, 09:47 AM

Originally Posted by Mayi757

As for standard pallets are we talking about 2 standard containers side by side (like under the belly)? Or top is loaded with bigger pallets that fit all the way across? I don't really know.

probably going to be bulk load in the belly, with the main deck taken up by a full width pallet.

NLovis · 02-13-2010, 10:48 AM

Really good. The dogs got more life ahead of them. These can replace 727 freighters. Bigger, less fuel. Companies like Fed ex will nab at it easily. UPS might as well after dropping a big portion of their fleet last year.

**hiss srq** · 02-13-2010, 11:54 AM

I doubt UPS will be looking into DC8 replacements. The only reason FedEx can afford to pick up the 777's they are taking is because of their military and poastal contracts. If it were not for that we wouldnt see the 777 and we defineately would not see them looking to swap 727's for 757's on a 1 for 1 ratio like they are. The cargo business be it air or ocean in particular is in BAD shape right now. UPS is not likely to replace the lift lost on the DC8 fleet retirement at least for a little while. In fact, the bottom 300 pilots are about to get furloughed from the list till around 2013 depending on a few internal events going on there right now.

If anything, alot of companies want to dump capacity just like the passenger lines. That goes for ocean too. This MD80 conversion might be good for some of the Central American cargo lift companies with older 727's and 732's that do bulk, and non palletized lift alot but a company like UPS probably wouldnt look at the 80 conversion. They dumped the 727 because they didnt want JT8's in the fleet anymore and the Rolls Royce Tay conversion had alot of technical problems. They spent HUGE money to update the 727 fleet to glass cockpit's and Tay's and in the end the airplanes were nearly useless because of problems with the Tay on the number two position of the 727.

NLovis · 02-13-2010, 10:27 PM

Originally Posted by hiss srq

I doubt UPS will be looking into DC8 replacements. The only reason FedEx can afford to pick up the 777's they are taking is because of their military and poastal contracts. If it were not for that we wouldnt see the 777 and we defineately would not see them looking to swap 727's for 757's on a 1 for 1 ratio like they are. The cargo business be it air or ocean in particular is in BAD shape right now. UPS is not likely to replace the lift lost on the DC8 fleet retirement at least for a little while. In fact, the bottom 300 pilots are about to get furloughed from the list till around 2013 depending on a few internal events going on there right now.

If anything, alot of companies want to dump capacity just like the passenger lines. That goes for ocean too. This MD80 conversion might be good for some of the Central American cargo lift companies with older 727's and 732's that do bulk, and non palletized lift alot but a company like UPS probably wouldnt look at the 80 conversion. They dumped the 727 because they didnt want JT8's in the fleet anymore and the Rolls Royce Tay conversion had alot of technical problems. They spent HUGE money to update the 727 fleet to glass cockpit's and Tay's and in the end the airplanes were nearly useless because of problems with the Tay on the number two position of the 727.

Remember the MD-90 has newer engines. There can always be a swap for that if the company is willing to spend. Only time will tell. As for Fed ex its more likely especally with those contracts. If they are looking to downsize that would be it. Smaller planes means less cargo space. More chances to fill the plane. Just have to wait and see

**DHG750R** · 02-14-2010, 01:57 AM

The MD-80SF's will likely be a niche aircraft. Perhaps companies like USA Jet who already operate the DC-9F might find them interesting. An abundance of 737-300's/-400's

UPS held on to their DC-8's in anticipation of needing the capacity from the failed DHL deal. They parked them shortly after that deal fell through so I doubt they would want them. On a side note, the entire UPS DC8 fleet was recently purchased by

IIRC the UPS 727-100QC's had Tay's on all 3 positions, glass f/d and were used for UPS's foray into the world of weekend charters when not carrying cargo.

Air freight is down like most things, but it has made a bit of a comeback - for some.
The demand for goods in the 4th qtr spiked since inventories were depleted over much of the year. So the outlook is not as dark as it was just 1 year ago. Airlines were agressive in removing excess capacity, It will just take longer to fully recover to the volume we had 2-3yrs ago.

Incidently, the 88x108" pallet is the same size used by the US millitary

NLovis · 02-14-2010, 03:53 AM

I knew those pallets were bigger but thats a big perk for the 80 conversion. Means they can do military runs. Be interesting to see that. Side note shocked those DC-8 were bought by somebody. Though UPS does a really good job keeping their a/c in top shape. Ah well just means the DC-8 still have some life in it. I think the dogs will get the same life span.