Pilot who flew Tommy Lee to concert, reckless flying

LOS ANGELES (AP) - A pilot faced reckless flying and other charges for landing a helicopter on a public street to pick up Tommy Lee and take him to a concert, prosecutors said.


David Keith Martz, 49, landed the helicopter July 7 outside a home in the Hollywood Hills to give the 43-year-old rocker a 50-mile flight to a Nine Inch Nails concert in Irvine, said Frank Mateljan, a spokesman for the City Attorney's Office.

Martz was charged with one count each of reckless flying, landing an aircraft on a public road and landing an aircraft without a permit, Mateljan said. Martz was to be arraigned in Hollywood on Wednesday.

Each charge carries a maximum penalty of six months in jail and a $1,000 fine.

Martz, who lives in the La Jolla area of San Diego County, has an unlisted telephone number and couldn't be reached. Mateljan said the city attorney's office didn't know the name of his lawyer.

Lee publicist Dvora Vener Englefield said Tuesday that Lee would have no comment.

Officers with the police department's Air Support Division, alerted by calls, spotted the helicopter hovering above the home and watched as the pilot landed on the street and went into the house.

Other officers went and told Martz that he had illegally landed on a public roadway, but Martz, Lee and two other passengers got into the aircraft and flew south, the city attorney's office said. Two hours later, the party returned and landed again despite being warned by authorities not to do so, officials said.

I absolutely cannot stand winers when it comes to stuff like that. Granted it is a law but reckless flying, come on. Landing without a permit happens more than you think though. I have a freind who routinely lands his jet ranger in very public places. I hope that they give the guy a break. Pain in the ass residental narc's drive me up the wall.

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Originally Posted by hiss srq

I absolutely cannot stand winers when it comes to stuff like that. Granted it is a law but reckless flying, come on. Landing without a permit happens more than you think though. I have a freind who routinely lands his jet ranger in very public places. I hope that they give the guy a break. Pain in the ass residental narc's drive me up the wall.

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Ahh are you serious? The dude landed a helicopter on a residential street. Cool as it may sound I don't think I'd appreciate a helicopter landing on my block. First off its totally reckless, what would have happened if he clipped something and went into a house? Second its illegal for the first reason I mentioned!

You know drinking and driving happens allot more then you think to. Perhaps we should let those guys off easily to. As for your Friend, he's an ass. BTW do you have your pilots license, please let me know if you ever go work for an airline so I know not to fly them. I rather fly with an airline that have intelligent flight crews. Sorry for being so harsh, but good god....... :roll:

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Originally Posted by hiss srq

I absolutely cannot stand winers when it comes to stuff like that. Granted it is a law but reckless flying, come on. Landing without a permit happens more than you think though. I have a freind who routinely lands his jet ranger in very public places. I hope that they give the guy a break. Pain in the ass residental narc's drive me up the wall.

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A helicopter landing on a residential street is extremely dangerous & unsafe & goes against every FAA rule in the book.

Give the guy a break? This pilot should lose his license....

i know that rotary-wing aircaft don't have the same altitude restrictions as fixed-wing but damn dude... you nuts?


hiss srq, dude grow up a little and realize that there is more to life than just having fun with what you do. it's possible, but making stupid decisions that put people's lives and property at risk is just dumb.

:roll: I am fairly sure this pilot knew what he was doing and I am sure he had a fairly working knowladge of the area he decided to put down in. I dont mean to go putting down anyplace you want but the bottom line is no he did not hurt anyone, and helicopters are designed to be able to fly in restricted areas. To answer other questions yes I am a commercial pilot, a no I do not go around breaking the guidelines constantly but sometimes you do break a rule. Are any of you guys pilots? Do any of you know how much the rules do get broken, seriously it is not a huge deal to put a little rotor wing into an area as long as there are no power lines etc.. in the immediate area. I am pretty sure that the helicopter would not have landed in the area if the pilot did not deem the area sufficent in distances for him to safely bring it in and out accounting for wind etc etc etc.... Stuff like this happens in the business more than you probably think. Fixed wing is obviously much more restricted in what you can and cannot do but things happen and most of the time no one is caught. One could apply this logic to driving as well . Some of you may have a high performance sports car and I am sure once in a while you stretch out her legs and work the gears. Is that against the laws? Yes. I mean you could say I am reckless than too with this logic I have exceeded 230 knots in class charlie airspace on departure a few times :twisted: it happens. So should I loose my ability to fly for a living? I do not think so. That is just my point and no harsh feelings ment to be sent to you all. I just hold a professional diffrence in opinion on this particular issue.

IF they landed the helicopter on Lee's private property, maybe I'd agree. But landing on a public street.....not acceptable.

If a pilot sees an open stretch of highway....would it be ok to land a Cessna there, whether he deems it safe or not?

Saying that other people break the rules also is not an excuse for illegal behavior. What this guy was was wrong, and he did it because he thought he was cool.

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Originally Posted by hiss srq

:roll: I am fairly sure this pilot knew what he was doing and I am sure he had a fairly working knowladge of the area he decided to put down in. I dont mean to go putting down anyplace you want but the bottom line is no he did not hurt anyone, and helicopters are designed to be able to fly in restricted areas. To answer other questions yes I am a commercial pilot, a no I do not go around breaking the guidelines constantly but sometimes you do break a rule. Are any of you guys pilots?

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On a daily basis, I work with many pilots, and have been in involved in aviation for over 20 years.....

Now saying that, landing a helicopter in a residential area is just plain moronic & unsafe, and of course, the little thing is that it is against the law.

Are we pilots? There are times that common sense needs to come into play....

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Originally Posted by hiss srq

seriously it is not a huge deal to put a little rotor wing into an area as long as there are no power lines etc.. in the immediate area. I am pretty sure that the helicopter would not have landed in the area if the pilot did not deem the area sufficent in distances for him to safely bring it in and out accounting for wind etc etc etc

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This was a public street and he didn't have authorization to do this...and therefore there is no way for him to KNOW whether it was safe to be doing. He wasn't in communication with someone on the ground and therefore was unaware of the conditions. This was totally dangerous and stupid, in my opinion.....honestly, anyone who thinks otherwise has no concept of safety.

What commercial airline do you fly for hiss srq?

I am not with an airline yet I fly Lears, a Navajo and occasionally a Robbinson R44 helicopter. Soon I will probably be with ExpressJet in the near future though. I applied to JetBlue recently but was turned down as I have not completed my 4 year degree yet. I have been flying since I was 9 years old. In fact I was in newsday summer of 2000 after completing a flight school program and clinic when I was a teen.

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Originally Posted by hiss srq

:roll: I am fairly sure this pilot knew what he was doing and I am sure he had a fairly working knowladge of the area he decided to put down in. I dont mean to go putting down anyplace you want but the bottom line is no he did not hurt anyone, and helicopters are designed to be able to fly in restricted areas. To answer other questions yes I am a commercial pilot, a no I do not go around breaking the guidelines constantly but sometimes you do break a rule. Are any of you guys pilots? .... Stuff like this happens in the business more than you probably think. Fixed wing is obviously much more restricted in what you can and cannot do but things happen and most of the time no one is caught.

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Not currently flying as a pilot, but flew KC-135s back in the day. I know too many guys who "knew what they were doing" and "sometimes...break a rule" who ended up dead because of it. The standard isn't "the bottom line is no he did not hurt anyone", the standard is what is legal and safe, not what you can get away with and not get caught.

Not only was this guy dangerous, he was stupid as well. From the original story:

Other officers went and told Martz that he had illegally landed on a public roadway, but Martz, Lee and two other passengers got into the aircraft and flew south, the city attorney's office said. Two hours later, the party returned and landed again despite being warned by authorities not to do so, officials said.

So they tell the guy what he did is illegal, and two hours later he comes right back and does it again. He should get his license pulled for stupidity if nothing else!

Here's a great example of "knowing what you're doing":


9wXF79xtTng

diffrent from landing on a road though, much diffrent, landing on a road happens all of the time. Bayflight does it, the police do it, civillian pilots do it. The issue comes down to the fact that there was no permit issued for that location. Nothing more nothing less. Apples and grapes flame it all you want but it took place guys. It does take place and every helicoter pilot is guilty of doing it. I have hovered a helicopter 30 feet off the roof of a girls house I was dateing at one time, a chopper pilot that works for my stepdads company has landed a S-76B in the back lot of my stepdads offices in Inwood on Burnside Ave. It happens.

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It does take place and every helicoter pilot is guilty of doing it. I have hovered a helicopter 30 feet off the roof of a girls house I was dateing at one time

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Dude your not helping your case any with that bright statement.

i am making the point that it is a bit stupid to bring up safety in this case as it happens all of the time, it will continue to happen and you could use this logic and say the pd, the medical guys etc......... are all in violation of the logic being used in this discussion to determine what is safe or what is not safe. Should the medical choppers be now restricted by landing on public roads? That is thge point I am making Tommy. We know what we are doing we are put through tons of schooling to learn how to do this and if this guy was a commercial rotor he knows his stuff and the only issue i see is unauthorized landing.

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Originally Posted by hiss srq

Should the medical choppers be now restricted by landing on public roads?

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That is a completely different situation. They do have clearance to land in public roads, and the area is surely made safe beforehand. You really can't compare a medical emergency to a rocker who thinks rules don't apply to him.

Also, your comments about how reckless you are make me glad that you aren't flying in NY airspace....and fear for when you might be in the future.

that is your opinion but hey there are 22+ clients who say othewise including some high profilers so no harm done. And I do not see that being reckless. No powerline no tree no big deal. Not like a cat is going to jump up only to be blown back down in my rotorwash anyway. As for dates I will be in town next week twice I will be in with the Lear 35 so with that logic I guess you you should be alerting the media I might do somthing like turn too steeply or an aggressive departure down the runway out of TEB. :twisted:

Listen, kid....my intention wasn't to imply that you are not a respected pilot, but all I know about your morals and view on safety is that "everyone breaks rules sometimes." When it comes to a big piece of metal in the sky, I don't want any rules broken by my pilot...or any flying anywhere near me. You haven't exactly painted the safest picture of yourself for us in this thread.

Safety is the utmost importance I am just looking to enlighten people because the oh gosh factor over landing in a street and what people want done to the pilot is a bit offensive because we all have a little fun with flying and I am not looking to rip or be ripped apart. I am making points about this and how it is very common to happen and not such a big deal. No harm no foul end of topic from me.

Honestly, I MIGHT be a bit more forgiving if he just did it once...but after a warning blatantly telling him what he did was illegal (which he should have known already) he flat out ignored and disrespected the law and did it AGAIN. You really think that's excusable? What makes him immune to rules? Also, I don't think that any "fun" is acceptable, considering the welfare of other people and their safety was not in his interest.

no the repeat part not excuseable but landing in public as a general fact is not a big issue now after being told not to repeat yes take action on that note actions are likely to be taken but landing in the street to me is just not an issue (in a helicopter) no hard feelings but I just hold a diffrent view on it than the rest of you. On that note I bid farewell as it is time for me to actually go fly.

Ryan...buddy...lets ponder this for a second. When ever the cops or the paramedics do it, the streets are cleared and everyone is expecting it. In this case the dude dropped outta the sky pretty much without warning. All it would've taken was one driver not paying attention and boom, big trouble. Now I've known you to have fun in the air, but always with safety in mind...

Tthis wasn't the brightest display of smarts in the world, especially doing it twice. And personally I can't stand when celebs think they can do whatever they want...

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Originally Posted by hiss srq

i am making the point that it is a bit stupid to bring up safety in this case as it happens all of the time...

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Why do you think this is even an acceptable excuse?

because if it was an issue many more helicopters would be crashing if it from things like this. If the area was a bad and dangerous place to land I am sure the pilot would not have done it, he saw it as a safe spot to put her down to pick up MR. Lee though maybe he should have just driven to the thing or went to the airport to catch a ride he did not, it happened and it is not a big issue. I am sure in NY that if that area was not so much more closely scrutinized airspace wise and the area was not soo cluttered with buildings, poles and wires you would see it more often. In NY if your transponder goes out they are all over it immediately, down here..... not so much. Out there.... maybe they do maybe they don't I have not shut my transponder off while flying out there recently but I will let you know how it goes. (sarcasm) Point be made I just have a diffrence in opinion in it that is all and I am sorry to any I may have smarted off to. I just hold diffrence in view on this specific issue and I always do keep safety in mind when plotting my fun.

I am not with an airline yet I fly Lears, a Navajo and occasionally a Robbinson R44 helicopter. Soon I will probably be with ExpressJet in the near future though. I applied to JetBlue recently but was turned down as I have not completed my 4 year degree yet. I have been flying since I was 9 years old. In fact I was in newsday summer of 2000 after completing a flight school program and clinic when I was a teen.

congrats, all that means to me is that you're rated and looking for something credible to argue around.

that is your opinion but hey there are 22+ clients who say othewise including some high profilers so no harm done. And I do not see that being reckless. No powerline no tree no big deal. Not like a cat is going to jump up only to be blown back down in my rotorwash anyway. As for dates I will be in town next week twice I will be in with the Lear 35 so with that logic I guess you you should be alerting the media I might do somthing like turn too steeply or an aggressive departure down the runway out of TEB.

why do high-profile people not have to follow the same rules as the rest of us non-high profilers? if you get into a car accident with someone with a trillion dollars and completely total his car because you didn't see him, he says not to worry about it cuz he can buy another YOU STILL WRECKED THE CAR. still think no harm no foul?

do people break rules? ablsolutely. it's one thing to speed on an empty highway at 4 in the morning and another to do it at 3 in the afternoon. when other people are involved the rules are there not only to protect your life but the lives of all those around you. take a lesson from my forner NCO... "rules are there to keep you safe. if you break them, you die... just like that."

Just from reading that article, I don't think any of us here can honestly say whether the decision to land was safe or unsafe. If the landing was done on a public road, (let's say one leading up to Mr. Lee's house) but not near many houses, trees or powerlines, it may have very well been safe to land there; much safer than landing than say at a place like the East 34th Street Heliport.
A lot of these celebrities have huge houses with "isolated" public roads leading to them.
But, seeing as how this happened in the hills of Hollywood, not rural Florida or rural America, and that enough people alerted the police to the event, it would seem that the decision to land on the road wasn't the "most safe" decision.

Now to my take on this:
The issue really at hand here is legality of all of this and the stupidity of the pilot. While I'm sure that the majority of helo pilots COULD make that landing without incident, there are reasons why landing on public roads is ILLEGAL. In this situation the helicopter pilot put himself above the LAW, and above aviation REGULATIONS, when he decided to land on a public road. When people blatantly disregard the LAW and REGULATIONS established with good meaning to safeguard the public, they put themselves above everybody else, and in turn put everyone at risk.

The real "slap in the face" here is that, if it wasn't bad enough the pilot disregarded the law and aviation regulations the first time, after he was explicity told by police what he had done was wrong and illegal he still decided to come back and do the exact same thing for a second time. For that reason, whether this guy is just a stupid pilot, or someone with a huge ego who thinks he can do whatever he wants, he should NEVER fly again.

And taking safety shortcuts is not just another part of the job. Hiss SRQ, do you alert your boss and your clients to the safety shortcuts you take?
While I haven't had all that much flying experience or training, I can tell you that based on my initial flying with the Air Force, and really with my day-to-day operations at the Air Force Academy for the past three years(much of which revolves around training future aviators), that safety is paramount. While many rules may seem dumb and pointless, they are set usually because people in the past have either been hurt or killed doing whatever it is that rule prohibits. When safety shortcuts are taken, it only becomes a matter of time before someone is hurt or killed.
When I was in my initial flight screening program for the Air Force this summer, safety, and diligently following the rules, was always briefed as the #1 priority. While it may have been really easy, and probably harmless to my flight, to skip certain preflight items, or to take shortcuts in flight, hundreds of people in military and general aviation flying who took those shortcuts and skipped those steps in the past, died, were seriously hurt, or seriously hurt or killed others as a result. And I can guarantee that among those people who do continue to take shortcuts, some of them will have the same fate one day.

Celebs and rich people in America will try to get away with just about anything. This pilot probably made the calculated decision to go ahead and do it because he'd rather risk paying a fine than upset a wealthy customer like Tommy Lee. Unfortunately, he at best inconvenienced and at worst put at risk the lives of the general public and also broke the law. There's a reason why commercial choppers are no longer permitted to land in places like the top of the old Pan Am building. I am not a pilot, but know several who have been flying professionally alot longer than since 2000, in fact, most have been flying since the Pan Am building was called that, and all of them have told me there are times when you as the captain of the aircraft have to draw the line in the name of safety, despite what your pushy millionaire in the back might want.

I've been trying to find Tommy Lee's house on Google Earth (no luck yet), but if its anything like the other places in the area, I wouldn't set a bird down in there. The houses are very close togeather, and in the areas where they're spread out there are alot of trees. Personally, I'd like to see where he landed first before I comment on the level of stupididy of this. I agree that once in a while, it's fun to break the rules. We only live once, and if you constantly follow what the "man" says you can be in for a dull life. But if you're going to do something illegal like that, use your head. Buzz someone's house? Maybe somewhere out west, but not in Levittown. You have to draw the line between doing something stupid safely and just doing something completely stupid. This was definately teetering on that line.

From this article, it looks like he lives in the 1800 block of Wattles Dr.

http://ktla.trb.com/news/ktla-tommy,0,5 ... tla-news-1

Here is the link to Maps.google.com:

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Wattles+D ... hl=en&om=1

Although there is enough room between the houses in his neighborhood, the road itself looks pretty curvy. I'm not sure someone would have enough time to stop if they saw a helicopter in the road.

Steve

Stuff like this is why the "careless and reckless" bit was written into the FAR. It doesn't matter if this happens "all the time," the simple fact is that it was fundamentally unsafe, not to mention illegal, and the pilot deserves nothing less than having his ticket pulled plus any civil/criminal charges that can be laid by local authorities.